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RE: I LOVE Religions
Posted on: October 12, 2017 at 23:30:46 CT
JeffB MU
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raskolnikov: I get very tired of Christians - who are essentially the only religion whose believers think that the events transcribed are historic and that they are the only way in - as it were.
I think it all really boils down to that so very critical question Pontius Pilate asked, "What is truth?". You apparently love religions that don't believe they necessarily have the truth, or who think that there are "multiple ways to get in", so to speak, so it really doesn't matter all that much what you believe.
To my mind that works well for subjective preferences like what kind of music you like or what is your favorite color, but not so much for what is the truth about the meaning to life.
What is truth? If Christianity is true, then there really is "one way in":
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me." John 14:6
If that is the truth, then it is not "mean" or "arrogant" to state that truth, or so it seems to me. In fact, I think it would be cruel not to proclaim the truth.
So once again, it really boils down to what IS the truth. Being upset because someone says that they know the truth and are telling you the truth does not seem to be reasonable to me.
raskolnikov: You comment that religion is our fundamental belief. Who is WE. Americans certainly do not as by and large Capitalism is our religion. Curious it is the POLAR opposite of what Jesus thought the Christ teached - the polar opposite. Now Greek Orthodox and Quakers and the Amish and Orthodox Jews and Sufis - THEY put their religion first. I don't see it anywhere else especially in the US.
Yes, it is true that many in the secular west have turned away from the truth, or have become lukewarm, but I am talking about how religion SHOULD be. Fwiw, I do think that there are still a lot of people who put their beliefs first and fashion their lives in conformity and in harmony with their beliefs. Actually, from what I've read, that's actually a little more true in the US than in Europe, but still way down from what it was in our grandparents' generation and earlier. The Orthodox, Quakers and Amish are all Christians, of course, which is a fulfillment of Judaism.
raskolnikov: Your question that if that foundation is twisted - there are ramifications. I say question itself has no grounds. YES - if your foundation is twisted, that spells trouble. But again Americans don't put religion first in their lives. So in that case you may be right - Capitalism is a pretty fcked up thing to put primary in ones life.
Again, "Americans" is a pretty broad category, there are millions who put their religion first. But you are right that many don't and the general apostacy and lukewarmness is causing great harm in our nation. It is a major reason we are off the rails right now. But not all is necessarily lost:)
if my people who are called by my name humble themselves, and pray and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and heal their land. (2 Chronicles 7:14)
raskolnikov: TRUTH you speak of is in the quest. We all come from ONE source or we do not. WE are all intricately attached and intertwined or we are not. TRUTH is that if we treat each other well - if we ascribe to Buddhist Loving Kindness or the Golden Rule which is common to all traditions and exclusive to known. Truth is that we are eternal beings having a human experiences. You may prefer Christian Myth, I don't know. LIVE IT and we are all better. LIVE by the foundation of any of the traditions and we are all better off. NOT a one has monopoly on that. So that is TRUTH. Preach and fail to live it - that's pretty empty. True Jihad - is overcoming yourself. THAT is Truth too.
There is truth in almost all religions, but they can't all be true in the same way at the same time, because they teach contradictory things at times. Yes, following the teachings of many of them would be an improvement over drifting along not really believing anything, but we can and should do better than that. We should seek the Truth and and when we find Him:
“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your strength, and with all your mind; and your neighbor as yourself.” Luke 10:27, cf. Mark 12:30
and we are promised by Our Lord, "You will seek me and find me; when you seek me with all your heart," (Jeremiah 29:13, cf. Deuteronomy 4:29, Matthew 7:7, Luke 11:9)
I think it all really boils down to that so very critical question Pontius Pilate asked, "What is truth?". You apparently love religions that don't believe they necessarily have the truth, or who think that there are "multiple ways to get in", so to speak, so it really doesn't matter all that much what you believe.
To my mind that works well for subjective preferences like what kind of music you like or what is your favorite color, but not so much for what is the truth about the meaning to life.
What is truth? If Christianity is true, then there really is "one way in":
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me." John 14:6
If that is the truth, then it is not "mean" or "arrogant" to state that truth, or so it seems to me. In fact, I think it would be cruel not to proclaim the truth.
So once again, it really boils down to what IS the truth. Being upset because someone says that they know the truth and are telling you the truth does not seem to be reasonable to me.
raskolnikov: You comment that religion is our fundamental belief. Who is WE. Americans certainly do not as by and large Capitalism is our religion. Curious it is the POLAR opposite of what Jesus thought the Christ teached - the polar opposite. Now Greek Orthodox and Quakers and the Amish and Orthodox Jews and Sufis - THEY put their religion first. I don't see it anywhere else especially in the US.
Yes, it is true that many in the secular west have turned away from the truth, or have become lukewarm, but I am talking about how religion SHOULD be. Fwiw, I do think that there are still a lot of people who put their beliefs first and fashion their lives in conformity and in harmony with their beliefs. Actually, from what I've read, that's actually a little more true in the US than in Europe, but still way down from what it was in our grandparents' generation and earlier. The Orthodox, Quakers and Amish are all Christians, of course, which is a fulfillment of Judaism.
raskolnikov: Your question that if that foundation is twisted - there are ramifications. I say question itself has no grounds. YES - if your foundation is twisted, that spells trouble. But again Americans don't put religion first in their lives. So in that case you may be right - Capitalism is a pretty fcked up thing to put primary in ones life.
Again, "Americans" is a pretty broad category, there are millions who put their religion first. But you are right that many don't and the general apostacy and lukewarmness is causing great harm in our nation. It is a major reason we are off the rails right now. But not all is necessarily lost:)
if my people who are called by my name humble themselves, and pray and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and heal their land. (2 Chronicles 7:14)
raskolnikov: TRUTH you speak of is in the quest. We all come from ONE source or we do not. WE are all intricately attached and intertwined or we are not. TRUTH is that if we treat each other well - if we ascribe to Buddhist Loving Kindness or the Golden Rule which is common to all traditions and exclusive to known. Truth is that we are eternal beings having a human experiences. You may prefer Christian Myth, I don't know. LIVE IT and we are all better. LIVE by the foundation of any of the traditions and we are all better off. NOT a one has monopoly on that. So that is TRUTH. Preach and fail to live it - that's pretty empty. True Jihad - is overcoming yourself. THAT is Truth too.
There is truth in almost all religions, but they can't all be true in the same way at the same time, because they teach contradictory things at times. Yes, following the teachings of many of them would be an improvement over drifting along not really believing anything, but we can and should do better than that. We should seek the Truth and and when we find Him:
“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your strength, and with all your mind; and your neighbor as yourself.” Luke 10:27, cf. Mark 12:30
and we are promised by Our Lord, "You will seek me and find me; when you seek me with all your heart," (Jeremiah 29:13, cf. Deuteronomy 4:29, Matthew 7:7, Luke 11:9)
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MESSAGE THREAD
RE: I LOVE Religions - JeffB MU - 10/12 23:30:46RE: They dont break down, they just all give the same answer - Butcher of Bakersfield STL - 10/13 03:27:06