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my concern is any infringement

Posted on: May 8, 2023 at 08:52:38 CT
DesertTiger MU
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on the right to bear arms stated in constitution, and then who gets to determine what's 'acceptable' infringement.

If 'mental illness' is the cause we are scared of someone being violent, who gets to sign off on that diagnoses? I've seen a whole lot of rhetoric from the left lately about many of my personal political beliefs and me being 'a threat to democracy'...seems dangerous to empower someone or a government the right to determine, subjectively, who gets to 'keep their constitutional rights'.

If we have laws, and someone breaks those laws by being violent, then we should put and keep them in prison. I can debate one way or the other about restoring firearms rights after time served, but at least that's a threshold someone, sadly, met that could justify keeping firearms out of their hands.
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MESSAGE THREAD

Blue State Gun Violence - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:00:25
     Its common sense, and the stupid responses below are the - FIJItiger MU - 5/8 08:20:14
          I can't say I disagree with any of that(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 09:12:25
          If I were ever to randomly shot it would not be in my - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 08:53:03
               9 older people went to church on Sunday, June 17, 2015 - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 09:15:19
                    There are outliers in any large data set. Focusing on them - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 09:16:47
                         They're people not outliers* - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 09:40:36
                              Data is data. Outlier is not a moral judgement. - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 09:56:06
                                   I'm more interested in people than being right(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 12:05:47
                         Hopefully you or someone you know doesn't become an outlier - FIJItiger MU - 5/8 09:18:53
                              Or you can be proactive and avoid high crime areas and your - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 09:59:42
                                   So many of these mass murders are in suburban areas - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 12:07:08
               I'm sure that is what most victims of mass shootings thought - FIJItiger MU - 5/8 08:55:52
     Wow amazing. In states where it is easier to obtain a - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 07:46:52
          Over 50% of gun deaths annually are from suicide… - Outsider MU - 5/8 07:56:44
               It is a way to make an urban problem appear to be a national - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 08:18:42
                    Is it possible that it is both?(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:24:22
                         Look at crime maps. Murder is NOT a national problem. - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 08:34:48
                              I hope you never do know anyone who is murdered. - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:38:26
                                   We do have the highest rate but it is not homogenous - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 08:50:47
                                        Of course it's not homogenous as any data set can be - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 09:00:59
                                             Our educational system spends disproportionately - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 09:15:48
                                                  property taxes are the huge lever - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 09:32:40
                                                       That was total per pupil spending. It takes into account - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 09:53:19
                                                            Don't agree with that at all. - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 12:37:01
                    Spot on. (nm) - Outsider MU - 5/8 08:22:17
          True, choosing poison, drowning, jumping off a tall building - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 07:50:44
               if it allows us to have a greater chance of intervening and - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:59:38
                    What's your solution? (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 08:00:45
                         Let's start with respectful discourse - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:09:14
                              RE: Let's start with respectful discourse - sarasotatiger MU - 5/8 08:33:50
                                   I agree with all of that(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:40:06
                              you contradict yourself - DesertTiger MU - 5/8 08:30:39
                                   No, I'm saying I have ideas but admit I could be wrong - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:35:00
                                        my concern is any infringement - DesertTiger MU - 5/8 08:52:38
                              respectful discourse: You misrepresented data in your OP, - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 08:29:06
                              But when you focus on guns you ignore the underlying - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 08:23:57
                              We have a big cultural problem alright - Sal CMSU - 5/8 08:10:22
                                   So it seems you already have the answers then. - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:12:20
                                        Nobody will ever change my mind that we - Sal CMSU - 5/8 08:15:04
                                             doesn't it depend on confiscate guns from whom? - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:19:51
                                                  Why stop at guns then? - Sal CMSU - 5/8 08:22:23
                                                       oh I'm with you on that. - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:26:09
               RE: True, choosing poison, drowning, jumping off a tall building - sarasotatiger MU - 5/8 07:55:24
               Also a male/female issue. Males overwhelmingly choose guns - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 07:54:34
          RE: Wow amazing. In states where it is easier to obtain a - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:49:31
               Slightly dated but I doubt the numbers change much. - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 08:07:58
                    Thanks for the link - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:11:00
                         But there are still obvious differences. - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 08:47:08
     now do demographics - Th8tnTiger MU - 5/8 07:42:22
          did you see Elon's white supremacist tweet?(nm) - CulturedDan MU - 5/8 07:50:40
               yes aaron rupar was not happy about it(nm) - Th8tnTiger MU - 5/8 07:54:36
                    what was the tweet? (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:56:00
                         RE: what was the tweet? (nm) - Th8tnTiger MU - 5/8 07:58:25
                              lol awesome (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:59:27
          Are you trying to inject nuance into his nice & tidy - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 07:49:24
     Yeah that whole MORE GUNS FOR EVERYBODY - mizzoumurfkc KC - 5/8 07:41:40
          The whole MORE INSANE because they are goo & chance - TigerFan92 STL - 5/8 08:07:04
          Because if there were no guns there would be no crime - DHighlander NWMSU - 5/8 07:50:07
               Because if there were less guns there would be - mizzoumurfkc KC - 5/8 08:00:11
                    how do you know that?(nm) - CulturedDan MU - 5/8 08:09:27
                    You believe that - Sal CMSU - 5/8 08:01:38
               Irrelevant, but carry on(nm) - Mormad MU - 5/8 07:52:03
          yes unfortunately true on both points(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:48:15
          What is your solution? (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:42:00
               There likely is no solution. You people have - mizzoumurfkc KC - 5/8 07:47:46
                    lol what? (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:49:25
                    "you people" - CulturedDan MU - 5/8 07:49:16
               Get rid of scary guns of course(nm) - redngray MU - 5/8 07:42:38
                    ...held by the common people. (nm) - ummmm MU - 5/8 07:45:14
                    He won't have the balls to say that - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:43:13
                         I'm not for gun confiscation, you 🤡 - mizzoumurfkc KC - 5/8 07:48:34
                              Do you want the You People to confiscate them? lol(nm) - TigerFan92 STL - 5/8 08:08:20
                              Why not? (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:51:22
                              "DO SOMETHING!" - CulturedDan MU - 5/8 07:50:17
                         I will concede that Lamar - redngray MU - 5/8 07:44:06
                              I'm actually interested in the discourse - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:52:42
                              RE: I will concede that Lamar: True, but he doubles down on - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 07:45:20
                                   You mean stoopid like lying POS cowards - mizzoumurfkc KC - 5/8 08:02:46
                                   RE: I will concede that Lamar: True, but he doubles down on - sarasotatiger MU - 5/8 07:54:18
     Dude needs to stay in his lane - CulturedDan MU - 5/8 07:36:37
          so he shouldn't research gun violence because - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:38:05
               go back and read what he posted (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:40:30
                    okay. and?(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:41:14
               no, he's the director of interpersonal violence and he's - CulturedDan MU - 5/8 07:39:44
                    how does that mean he should stay in his lane? - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:41:02
                         Where did I say he should shut up? - CulturedDan MU - 5/8 07:43:49
                              Stay in his lane? - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:50:59
                                   Relevant gun data would be violence - which he apparently - CulturedDan MU - 5/8 07:52:49
                                        that's not a good analogy to me - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:55:03
                                             What's the solution to addressing the problem? (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:57:20
                                                  I don't have the solutions but I'd think that - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:07:48
                                   It isn't relevant data (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:51:42
                                        I find it relevant though. - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:53:35
                                             It isn't relevant (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:57:37
                                                  to you - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:12:59
                                                       I never claimed that (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 08:14:21
                                                            Okay. Thanks for clarifying(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:15:00
                         You're struggling with basic words today (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:41:40
     You cited the speaker; I stand corrected. But why not cite - hokie VT - 5/8 07:29:32
     Blue City gun deaths dwarf all others(nm) - TigerFan92 STL - 5/8 07:23:52
          Yep. It’s interesting that the study focuses on state… - Outsider MU - 5/8 07:28:42
          Not per capita. (nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:27:00
               lol you can't be helped commie(nm) - TigerFan92 STL - 5/8 07:37:16
                    sorry just trying to help you understand(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:38:27
     How many guns are there by State. Are you telling us those - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 07:23:45
          it's per capita(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:27:30
               RE: it's per capita: Why didn't you include that in your OP? - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 07:35:02
                    because it doesn't take a PhD to understand that(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:38:48
                         You were caught misrepresenting statistical information. - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 07:44:15
                              It sounds like you need to be right - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:56:53
          Or California? The premise is flawed. (nm) - Outsider MU - 5/8 07:25:16
     RE: Blue State Gun Violence - sarasotatiger MU - 5/8 07:21:17
     How many murders with guns? How many deaths from all other - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 07:20:09
     You quote people without context, you cite speeches - hokie VT - 5/8 07:19:27
          It's a direct quote from an academic who studies - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:24:24
               RE: It's a direct quote from an academic: He's an advocate - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 07:36:49
                    RE: It's a direct quote from an academic: He's an advocate - sarasotatiger MU - 5/8 07:59:19
                    so you're unwilling to accept data from anyone who - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:39:45
                         Not what I posted. If you were honest, you wouldn't attempt - BH O'bonga MU - 5/8 07:47:25
                              Help me understand your post then because - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:57:50
          RE: You quote people without context, you cite speeches - sarasotatiger MU - 5/8 07:23:11
     What's the point of this information?(nm) - ummmm MU - 5/8 07:03:32
          Where there are more guns, there are more deaths. - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:13:12
               You didn't answer his question (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:24:18
                    Yes. He did answer the question... - mizzoumurfkc KC - 5/8 07:42:57
                    He asked the point. I restated the point the author made(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:26:16
                         That point is meaningless - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:28:15
                              that's your opinion but I certainly disagree (nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:40:15
                                   You don't think there should be an action item? (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:42:23
                                        No there should not - meatiger MU - 5/8 08:16:26
               Even if it were true (and even if we accepted your cherry - ummmm MU - 5/8 07:21:42
                    This is the problem here - meatiger MU - 5/8 08:15:15
                         What good is the data without a solution to - Sal CMSU - 5/8 08:20:06
                    That's a different question. - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:25:15
                         Here's your chance to answer it (nm) - Sal CMSU - 5/8 07:25:46
          Contrary to what he says - redngray MU - 5/8 07:10:00
               You really are full of fear(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:13:33
                    Am I the one constantly posting about guns? - redngray MU - 5/8 07:14:54
                         What do you constantly post about? - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:18:46
                              You've been riding the wave - ummmm MU - 5/8 07:23:18
                              This post is full of irrational fear.(nm) - ummmm MU - 5/8 07:22:29
                              Strange post but ok(nm) - redngray MU - 5/8 07:20:50
                                   Not willing to answer?(nm) - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:25:30
                                        Answer what? - redngray MU - 5/8 07:29:38
                                             Sure. - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 07:43:08
                                                  I’m not constantly starting threads about them - redngray MU - 5/8 07:45:34
                                                       constantly? - LamarFrazier MU - 5/8 08:17:02




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