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RE: Why should we believe that 'this time is different'

Posted on: January 4, 2018 at 13:06:22 CT
JeffB MU
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"and we could throw off government rule and live in anarchy from then on?"

Advances in technology and leisure time, plus refined moralities. The concept of individual liberty (as a written philosophy) is still very young. The greatest additions to the school of thought have occurred in the last 250 years.

I think our 'refined moralities' are clearly a devolution from even a half century ago. Several of our founding fathers commented on the necessity of a moral people for a well functioning government and I think that is every bit as true of an anarchistic society.

Advances in weaponry, especially weapons of mass destruction also make an anarchistic society far more dangerous than even is the case of a society with a government. If anyone, including the mentally ill have access to mortars, chemical and biological weapons and even nuclear materials if they can afford them, that's little more than an accident waiting to happen.
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hi, I'm pickle. I'm an anarchist and lover of liberty...AMA! - pickle MU - 1/4 12:21:36
     the recent swatting incident - SwampTiger MU - 1/4 13:01:27
          The ones who committed a crime - pickle MU - 1/4 13:05:40
               So calling up the swatter to induce him to call in the swat - JeffB MU - 1/4 13:09:09
               would hiring a hit man be a crime? - SwampTiger MU - 1/4 13:08:52
                    No, hiring a hit man is not a crime (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 13:10:03
                         If you believe in anarchy, what *is* a crime? - JeffB MU - 1/4 15:10:55
          I gotta say, that incident is a confounding one - ummmm MU - 1/4 13:03:42
               I've gone back and forth on that - pickle MU - 1/4 13:07:00
     Step 1 - MizzouTigerz MU - 1/4 12:48:29
          Do you have a question? (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 13:03:56
     What do you do to advance your anarchist values? - Grasslands MU - 1/4 12:46:07
          I discuss them where and when appropriate - pickle MU - 1/4 13:01:54
     I still don't know what you do about those that don't follow - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 12:44:25
          RE: I still don't know what you do about those that don't follow - pickle MU - 1/4 12:51:06
               so tribes, North America prior to the arrival of the Europe(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:02:53
                    What? (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 13:04:15
                         Native Americains lived in tribes much the way you - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:09:27
                              when did pickle talk about tribes? (nm) - 90Tiger MU - 1/4 13:49:20
                                   Not in this thread, but a couple of years ago... - JeffB MU - 1/4 14:56:08
                                   he didn't, I'm just trying to relate some historical - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:56:17
                                        he didn't describe a society. you keep using your future-vis - 90Tiger MU - 1/4 14:07:36
                                             i believe mankind is inherently good and cooperative, and - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:19:07
                                                  I didn't state any society requirements - pickle MU - 1/4 14:26:40
                                                       "societies based upon voluntary relationships and exchanges" - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:30:12
                                                            Why do you keep cutting off the sentence? - pickle MU - 1/4 14:34:38
                                                                 you discribe a society that you believe would fix the system - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:37:49
                                                                      No I don't (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 15:41:33
                                                  you keep saying it doesn't exist as if you're being - 90Tiger MU - 1/4 14:20:48
                                                       you claim he didn't describe a society, I claim he did(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:26:45
                              ??? I don't know where you got that from - pickle MU - 1/4 13:13:24
                                   tell me this doesn't describe early tribal life: - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:22:40
                                        That doesn't describe "early tribal life" (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 13:25:17
                                             sure it does: - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:35:06
                                                  It doesn't. Early tribal life were under big man societies - pickle MU - 1/4 13:51:21
               'There would be means for dispute resolution' - JeffB MU - 1/4 12:57:33
     EMAW! - MIZZOUowns SEC - 1/4 12:34:11
     'compromised since birth, not by choice' - JeffB MU - 1/4 12:32:49
     If government was eliminated - cnk ATL - 1/4 12:28:49
          well they already are part of society - pickle MU - 1/4 12:34:13
               what mechanism would stop them from being aggressive - cnk ATL - 1/4 12:41:08
                    competing groups of security forces - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 1/4 13:02:49
                    armed individuals - pickle MU - 1/4 12:44:15
                         so Shane would come back and provide justice(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 12:46:58
                              I don't know who Shane is (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 13:07:22
                                   you've never seen the movie SHANE? - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:11:11
                                        Yes, I've seen the movie Shane - pickle MU - 1/4 13:14:00
                                             you see Shane came in and made sure those - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:20:25
                                                  RE: you see Shane came in and made sure those - pickle MU - 1/4 13:26:31
                                                       your utopia society is fictional too(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:35:55
                                                            it's your fiction, not pickle's that you're arguing about he - 90Tiger MU - 1/4 13:54:44
                                                                 so this society exists somewhere? cause if it doesn't - - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:57:40
                                                                      again, it's YOUR fiction, not pickle's. He isn't layingout - 90Tiger MU - 1/4 14:08:47
                                                                           he drew the picture "i believe mankind is inherently good - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:20:45
                                                                                That's not fiction, that's fact (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 14:27:46
                                                                                     your belief does not make it fact(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:29:26
                                                                                          That's the first correct thing you've said today (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 15:42:05
                                                                                odd, my entire 50+ years on earth have been 99.999995% - 90Tiger MU - 1/4 14:21:41
                                                                                     well, I was in construction for 33 years, so as long as it - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:25:13
                                                                                          I think you misunderstand (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 14:30:04
                                                            I don't advocate utopia - pickle MU - 1/4 13:52:55
               you left out the part about believing in utopia - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 12:39:57
               'They wouldn't last long being aggressive and violent' - JeffB MU - 1/4 12:35:57
                    lol - baltimore is a gvmt example. man you're dumb, Jeff (nm) - 90Tiger MU - 1/4 13:55:47
                         You don't seem to be following the conversation very well... - JeffB MU - 1/4 15:45:38
                    Looks like two instances of failed govts. (nm) - ummmm MU - 1/4 12:40:43
                         Perhaps, but even so, his contention that - JeffB MU - 1/4 12:47:32
                              RE: Perhaps, but even so, his contention that - ummmm MU - 1/4 12:52:05
                                   RE: Why should we believe that 'this time is different' - JeffB MU - 1/4 13:06:22
                                        I agree that moralities are less refined than 50 years ago - ummmm MU - 1/4 13:13:25
                                             'far less capital would be directed to building weapons of - JeffB MU - 1/4 14:16:47
                                             there was no gov't at the dawn of mankind, but weapons were - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:45:46
                                                  There were no societies at the dawn of mankind - pickle MU - 1/4 13:57:04
                                                       of course there were extended families were societies - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:04:48
                                                            there were no societies at the dawn of mankind - pickle MU - 1/4 14:31:02
                                                                 a family isn't a society? I believe it is and has been - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:33:07
                         and places where many people aren't - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 12:45:59
                              Recognizing what you just wrote, it would seem ever more - ummmm MU - 1/4 12:52:57
                                   far less likely than mob rule(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:12:26
                                        I guess we should just ignore all present and historical - ummmm MU - 1/4 13:16:09
                                             Ignore WWII and the atomic bombing of Japan (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 13:32:08
                                                  why? if your society can develop roads, cars, electronics - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 13:38:18
                                                       It's your argument. You said it would be less likely - pickle MU - 1/4 13:54:28
                                                            when has a governmentless society EVER ended - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:06:14
                                                                 Gvmt is mob rule (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 14:31:30
                                                                      I don't disagree, but no govt ends in mob rule as well(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:33:50
                                                                 isn't democracy defined as the will of the majority? that's - 90Tiger MU - 1/4 14:10:49
                                                                      did I disagree? My point is gov't or no gov't - MOB RULE(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 1/4 14:22:27
                                                                           That wasn't your point and you've contradicted yourself - pickle MU - 1/4 14:33:23
                                                       Partially answered here: - ummmm MU - 1/4 13:39:02
                                        Gvmt is mob rule (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 13:15:18
          they could join private "security forces" - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 1/4 12:32:56
               No one has ever told you that. Why the need to lie? (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 12:35:36
     Your liberty has been compromised by your own bad choices. - RHAYWORTH MU - 1/4 12:23:21
          Do you have a question? (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 12:28:09
               RE: Do you have a question? (nm) - JeffB MU - 1/4 12:34:40
     Wonderful, now what about the Reptilians?(nm) - RayKinsella1922 SEC - 1/4 12:22:45
          I don't know what you're talking about (nm) - pickle MU - 1/4 12:27:47
     Go blow a goat (nm) - Tigrrrr! MU - 1/4 12:21:57
          Any topic, Tigrrr. Government, politics, liberty, economics, - pickle MU - 1/4 12:29:54
               Ok - Tigrrrr! MU - 1/4 12:59:54




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