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I need to back up a step, I meant omniscient, not omnipotent

Posted on: September 21, 2016 at 11:40:52 CT

cnk MU

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M.O.B. Votes:

your example is not quite what I'm getting at so my use of the wrong term may have led to that. Let's say you are driving down a road that forks. You believe you have to choose left or right as you approach it. However, there is a being that already knows that you are going to "choose" to go right. In your view, you chose to go right. To the omniscient being you did what it already knew you were going to do. The reality is that your choice was an illusion.

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MESSAGE THREAD

Want to be clear 4Tigs - raskolnikov MU - 9/21 11:24:49

"Free Will" does not mean "Without Consequences" - Spanky KU - 9/21 12:51:40

Hell is eternal separation from God. He is not a rapist. He - JeffB MU

- 9/21 11:59:55

And there are consequences to their decisions - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 12:02:20

Very true. (nm) - JeffB MU

- 9/21 12:04:41

Here is the part of God - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:30:42

Lol(nm) - Panthera MU - 9/21 11:37:37

RE: Here is the part of God - raskolnikov MU - 9/21 11:37:35

God is Truth, something for which you seem to have a rather - JeffB MU

- 9/21 12:06:21

I agree that God is Truth - Hu, Allah Hu, Allah Hu - raskolnikov MU - 9/21 12:10:18

I can bust your balls about your politics, but have to - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 12:03:46

If you make the intent and emotions of sinful mankind - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:40:02

I do not get your meaning of "putting intent and emotions - raskolnikov MU - 9/21 11:42:31

You speak of a muslims heart wrenching regret and dispair - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:44:58

Please don't connect things not connected - raskolnikov MU - 9/21 11:49:00

There is one path to salvation - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:51:38

Again, hold the thought God tells you or you're damned - raskolnikov MU - 9/21 12:13:32

Jesus also siad - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 12:15:16

Ah, 4Tigs, the mortal man - the only mortal man capable of - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:33:25

The only way I know God's intent is through the Word - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:34:15

What language did God provide his Word in? (nm) - ummmm MU - 9/21 11:42:56

Orginally it was written in Greek, Aramaic and Hebrew(nm) - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:45:36

How did it get into English? (nm) - ummmm MU - 9/21 11:49:22

Translators - obviously. - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:52:21

Would you agree things are lost in translation? (nm) - ummmm MU - 9/21 11:58:47

Yes, certainly - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 12:03:07

Which is the faithful and English translation of the Bible?(nm) - ummmm MU - 9/21 12:06:13

There are several - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 12:10:48

How can there be more than one faithful translation? (nm) - pickle MU

- 9/21 12:35:43

is this a legitimate question? think pickle, - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 12:39:27

Laughable. you bible interpreters have been fighting since - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:35:58

Hardly laugable - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:37:57

It's nothing but laughable. There is no battle. God knows be - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:40:02

How would God be wrong? - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:40:57

LMFAO (nm) - pickle MU

- 9/21 13:00:25

You just stated He know before hand that you will reject o - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:43:13

Again, you confusing knowing a choice someone will make - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:46:45

If God knows BEFORE the choice is made and God is - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:52:50

Again, I know if you offer my son a cookie or celery he will - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:53:47

That analogy fails utterly because you don't "know" in t - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 12:07:42

RE: You just stated He know before hand that you will reject o - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 11:44:02

Lol(nm) - Panthera MU - 9/21 11:41:51

god knows how you'll decide before you're born, but, really, - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:53:35

why does this issue bother you so much? - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 11:36:25

why the straw man? (nm) - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 11:34:07

Don't bother - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:34:42

believing god is omnipotent eliminates the possibility of - cnk ATL - 9/21 11:29:08

Why does that eliminate the possibility of free will?(nm) - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:32:02

if a being exists that is truly omniscient - cnk ATL - 9/21 11:33:37

Knowing what will happen is not to say you did - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:35:49

I need to back up a step, I meant omniscient, not omnipotent - cnk ATL - 9/21 11:40:52

he knows everything there is to know - tigerinhogtown STL - 9/21 12:38:16

that's not omniscience(nm) - cnk ATL - 9/21 12:39:13

I thought it was knowing everything ther is to know(nm) - tigerinhogtown STL - 9/21 13:13:35

Precisely - given the omniscient being cannot be wrong. - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 12:12:06

Where in this do I go to hell for masturbating?(nm) - hefeweizen MU

- 9/21 11:42:49

BOAISY(nm) - cnk ATL - 9/21 11:47:13

no, the person still has a choice and makes it. - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 11:42:44

You are not omniscient, you predicted that Denver would win - cnk ATL - 9/21 11:46:52

never said i was. a omniscient being does not mean the - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 12:11:55

your example implied you absolutely knew Denver would - cnk ATL - 9/21 12:14:21

and how does the beings omniscience take away from the - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 12:17:11

the mortal is not able to deviate from what the omniscient - cnk ATL - 9/21 12:25:55

no, it is still a choice to the mortal. - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 12:27:31

back to my movie example - cnk ATL - 9/21 12:30:55

life is not a movie. - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 12:32:53

correct, to the omniscient being time would not be - cnk ATL - 9/21 12:36:04

You are confusing knowing what you are going to do - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:41:47

no, I'm not saying the omniscient being is coercing - cnk ATL - 9/21 11:45:39

If you offer my youngest celery or a cookie he will choose - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:48:47

you are not omniscient - cnk ATL - 9/21 11:53:23

Every now and then we get to do this - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:56:20

I respect your beliefs - cnk ATL - 9/21 12:03:24

There is nothing "logical" by our standards of a God of the - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 12:05:28

now come over to The Shack so I can say horrible things - cnk ATL - 9/21 12:12:08

Fair enough - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 12:13:12

Illogical and impossible. One can't state an entity knows th - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:36:42

To the mind of man, much of God's nature and will is - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:43:11

what? - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 11:37:23

"God has a plan for you, well, unless you don't follow it in - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:34:43

God knows all things - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:36:40

lmfao - so people are born PRE-DESTINED (because God knows - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:38:31

Again, knowing what someone will do - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:52:58

When you are omniscient and cannot be wrong, it most - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 12:13:51

only to the omniscient being. not the mortal one. - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 12:18:36

a being knowing the choice in advance does not mean the - mizzou alum 93 MU - 9/21 11:39:31

Yes, the BELIEF eliminates the possiblity - raskolnikov MU - 9/21 11:31:20

Free will under the threat of eternal damnation or the promi - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:30:30

See above - 4TigersinMichigan MU - 9/21 11:32:32

Laughable. Utterly and completely ludicrous. (nm) - 90Tiger MU - 9/21 11:34:04

You also dont get that immoral, illegal and unethical - hefeweizen MU

- 9/21 11:26:17