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Yeah, I'm still not convinced SEC is better.

Posted on: February 14, 2018 at 11:32:12 CT
tjwheeler UI
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I'm sure you'll disagree and that's fine.

But, it depends how "better" is defined. SEC won more games in the challenge and if pushed, I'd likely say the SEC is better than the B12.

But, I expect the B12 to have teams go farther in the tourney and if I remember correctly, wasn't that the argument used to criticize the B10 in recent years even when the SEC was the 5th or 6th best conference, the B10 was the top conference and Kentucky won the title?

The SEC is having a great year and conferences rise/fall in waves. But, I also think the SEC has great parity---which doesn't really equate to having great, elite teams who match the potential of those in the B12.

I could be wrong and would happily admit it, but this is my current thinking.

Thanks for the dialogue.
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Cuonzo Martin is a wizard - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 15:19:11
     I like Warlock but - catbirdseat MU - 2/14 15:20:43
     And yet some of us knew this was coming. - gaber c. MU - 2/14 11:49:44
     Well-stated(nm) - raskolnikov MU - 2/14 11:31:05
     Yes, he's rebuilt the program in 1 year.(nm) - Mizzmi27 MU - 2/14 11:19:20
     And yet you still give him strike 1. (nm) - Bucky Larson MU - 2/14 10:50:07
     I see him more as a 5th level cleric. - GoldenTiger MU - 2/14 10:34:01
     Lost 4 of the top 6 players? - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 09:54:58
          Productivity does not matter to Fiji. And not - alwaysright MU - 2/14 11:04:19
          It's got a top 10 team - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 10:03:06
          He is totally clueless. (nm) - go tigers MU - 2/14 10:02:00
               And proves it on a daily basis (nm) - hou4mu MU - 2/14 10:53:57
          Fiji has an irrational hatred of Kim - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 2/14 09:59:59
          Top 6 players last year for MU - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:56:14
               Russell Woods was better than Puryear - hou4mu MU - 2/14 10:51:47
                    FYI, they are both on that 6 player list (nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 10:56:02
               Well, assuming you can just make an ignorant list, yes(nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 09:58:49
                    People who subjected themselves to watching MU play last - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 10:01:31
                         I went to every home game last year and watched the rest - go tigers MU - 2/14 10:04:15
                              While I believe you watch all of our games - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 10:05:48
                         My subjective opinion is you didn't watch closely(nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:03:25
               Geist did far more than Hughes ever did. But you - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:58:01
                    I was talking about ability, not production - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:59:58
                         I think Kemp, Rau, Glassman, Wolf had the most ability - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:01:18
                              They did not. Leads me to question the validity of your - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 10:02:24
                                   You weren't watching closely enough. My subjective opinion - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:02:55
                                        You are entitled to that incorrect opinion - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 10:04:26
                                             My subjective opinion says you are objectively wrong(nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:05:38
          He is a clown(nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:56:03
               There will always be a course correction - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 09:59:57
     Toughest conferenec? - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:40:32
          It could be debated. Just not effectively (nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:41:37
               Where are your facts to prove it? - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:42:47
                    Take conference games out of the two schedules and look - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 09:47:31
                         What was the final count in the SEC/Big 12 Challenge?(nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:48:17
                              SEC - 6 Big 12 -4 - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:51:13
                                   How did the SEC decide which programs wouldn't participate?(nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 09:57:55
                                        You keep bringing this up. While that may be an advantage - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 10:01:39
                                             I brought it up once since B12-SEC challenge day. - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:05:05
                                                  according to your post below, that would be the 11th time - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 10:08:09
                                                       I discussed on day of challenge and then again today. - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:09:56
                                                            I'm not twisting facts. - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 10:14:42
                                                                 "advantage was non-existent" - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:19:43
                                                                      Yes, it is very unlikely that it happens, but it DID happen - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 10:22:04
                                                                      3 of the 4 b12 wins came against our 11, 12, 13 teams. - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 10:21:50
                                                                           Home teams? - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:28:16
                                                                                TJ, your point is that the SEC gets to choose who plays. ok. - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 10:54:05
                                                                                     I understand the meta here. - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 11:22:24
                                                                      In theory, our 10th best team should be as bad/good - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:21:33
                                                                           Not if you take out the 4 programs with the worst - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:24:32
                                                                                Here it is in cold truth. Played 59 - 67. Didn't play 29-21. - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 10:34:52
                                                                                     Thanks(nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 11:25:46
                                                                                okay, but this year 75% of the b12 wins came against our - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 10:27:06
                                                                                We are in 3rd place in the conference and didn't even - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:25:45
                                                                                     And an exemplar doesn't equate to the norm(nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:28:56
                                                                                          Doesn't really matter. We aren't talking historically. - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:31:43
                                                                                               Yeah, I'm still not convinced SEC is better. - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 11:32:12
                                                                                          we're talking about one year, not the norm. - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 10:31:21
                                                                 I really do think the SEC is stronger than the Big 12 this - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:15:44
                                                                      I agree (nm) - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 10:19:50
                                        Based on records the previous year - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:58:40
                                             But our BOTTOM FOUR teams played in it this year. - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 10:09:59
                              6-4 SEC (nm) - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 09:50:23
                    There aren't facts to support what is the toughest conf - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:45:36
                         And you are completely biased - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:48:36
                              No statistical measure has the SEC as #1 - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 09:56:17
                                   While you start with facts or objectivity, you finish - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 10:00:07
                                        True. Projections and predictions must include them - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:02:26
                                   concur (nm) - DC Jayhawk KU - 2/14 09:59:15
                                   There aren't statistical measurements that effectively - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:57:35
                                        LOL(nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 09:58:19
                              I said already you can make an argument for those confs - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:49:32
                                   But the SEC would - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:51:48
                                        It has 11 strong programs, with the most talent and - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:53:20
                                             So you are calling LSU and Georgia strong - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:55:29
                                                  Yes (nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:57:59
                                                       Georgia's coach will likely get fired - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 10:02:40
                                                            Just proves how great of a job he's doing. (nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:05:56
                                                            They are 4-8 due to playing in the nation's toughest conf(nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 10:03:25
                                                                 I repeat they are not a strong program - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 10:06:32
                                                  And Rick Barnes and Bruce Pearl are strong coaches. - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 09:57:16
                                                       You don't think they are good coaches? They clearly are (nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:59:52
                                                            No, I don't and never have. - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:06:46
                                                                 Tennessee was in the gutter and he has made them good - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:09:05
                                                                      I'm taking the unpopular stance here, I'm sure. - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 10:11:20
                                                  Hahaha (nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:56:13
                         This is my favorite all-time post of yours(nm) - tjwheeler UI - 2/14 09:47:39
                              Thanks I try and offer a plethora of options to choose from(nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:48:21
                    The ACC is the best conference total IMO. The RPI - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:43:15
                         Yeah they are always top heavy - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:44:25
          The ACC is the best conference as far as high end teams - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:40:58
               Big 12 can make an argument too - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:41:50
                    Other than Texas Tech and W. Virginia they are all weak (nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:47:04
                         KU is way down but you can't call them weak - Hoosier Daddy1 IU - 2/14 09:54:00
                              Neither of those teams would be in the top half of the SEC - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:55:02
     Disagree about a few points - MizzouAstro MU - 2/14 09:38:18
          RE: Disagree about a few points - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:43:31
               Silly - MizzouAstro MU - 2/14 09:45:30
                    I would disagree with "athletic freak" big time. Athletic - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:46:49
                         He can't get to the rim because he can't dribble - MizzouAstro MU - 2/14 09:47:55
                              that is a fact. biggest weakness is handles. nm - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 09:57:50
                                   I agree but he isn't some athletic freak. (nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:00:55
                                        he absolutely is(nm) - MizzouAstro MU - 2/14 10:08:19
                                             No(nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:09:58
                                                  his monsterous dunks and ability to defend 4 positions - MizzouAstro MU - 2/14 10:16:30
                                                       He is probably not as strong as Puryear, can't defend - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:18:41
                                                            Actually no probably to it. He isn't as strong as Puryear(nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 10:22:11
                                                                 Puryear is a PF. He is close to his strength and a much - MizzouAstro MU - 2/14 10:35:39
                    Or his 2 coaches at Texas - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:46:33
                         He isn't a 5th year senior(nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:47:42
          Puryear has been playing great help defense but he's - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:40:09
               I said he is always in the right spot - MizzouAstro MU - 2/14 09:41:22
     There are several good individual defensive players. Not - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:33:22
          Who are they? (nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:34:12
               Geist is a pest and has played great defense all year long. - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:35:40
                    RE: Geist is a pest and has played great defense all year long. - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:40:12
                         They absolutely can. (nm) - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:40:34
     Cratered(nm) - Le Tigre - 2/14 09:29:23
     still underperforming pundit expectations but imagine how - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 2/14 09:28:13
          Do you honestly think - kcnorthside MU - 2/14 09:41:34
          weren't we picked 6th in the SEC with MPJ? - Fire Marshall Bill MU - 2/14 09:35:28
               depends which pundits(nm) - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 2/14 09:42:48
          With a little more effort and less 'woe is me' attitude, its - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:33:15
               effort was never the problem for Kim - Fire Marshall Bill MU - 2/14 09:36:11
                    Talking about Kim's effort, not the players effort for Kim - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:37:17
     Where was Kassius going before he committed to MU? (nm) - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 09:24:47
          canisius college (nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:26:38
               Had he been recruited as a transfer - kmawv8 MU - 2/14 09:29:11
                    He had the choice between us and GA Tech. Thankfully - TheWildcat STL - 2/14 09:33:48
                    Believe Mann identified and brought him to campus (nm) - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:30:52
                    He also visited Georgia Tech(nm) - Conan the Librarian MU - 2/14 09:29:40
     All starts with defense and the great thing, aside from - Diamond Dave MU - 2/14 09:23:14
     so you know nothing about defense? - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 09:23:09
          Just imagine what he will be able to do with players - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:24:16
               So you're saying the players we currently have - Civil-E-Tiger MU - 2/14 09:34:37
                    They have become better defenders. - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:36:28
               You're not giving our guys enough credit for the individual - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 09:26:19
                    I am giving them credit. They are overcoming their - FIJItiger MU - 2/14 09:27:44
                         shaking my head. - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 09:38:06
                              I think his point is valid. To be a good defender you need - GeorgiaTiger76 MU - 2/14 09:51:16
                                   I'd argue the most imortant thing is court awareness. - bornoncampus MU - 2/14 09:56:13




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