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He or she is a human being, not merely a clump of tissues,

Posted on: October 12, 2017 at 14:38:29 CT
JeffB MU
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and that is a scientific question, not a religious or personal one as you well know. I can only conclude that you are lying to support your position, as we have gone over this before multiple times:

https://prolifepages.wordpress.com/when-does-life-begin-senate-judiciary-subcommittee-hearings-april-1981/


When does human life begin? – Senate Judiciary Subcommittee Hearings April 1981

* In 1981 (April 23-24) a Senate Judiciary Subcommittee held hearings on the very question before us here: When does human life begin? Appearing to speak on behalf of the scientific community was a group of internationally-known geneticists and biologists who had the same story to tell, namely, that human life begins at conception – and they told their story with a profound absence of opposing testimony.

Dr. Micheline M. Mathews-Roth, Harvard medical School, gave confirming testimony, supported by references from over 20 embryology and other medical textbooks that human life began at conception.

* “Father of Modern Genetics” Dr. Jerome Lejeune told the lawmakers: “To accept the fact that after fertilization has taken place a new human has come into being is no longer a matter of taste or opinion … it is plain experimental evidence.”

* Dr. Hymie Gordon, Chairman, Department of Genetics at the Mayo Clinic, added: “By all the criteria of modern molecular biology, life is present from the moment of conception.”

* Dr. McCarthy de Mere, medical doctor and law professor, University of Tennessee, testified: “The exact moment of the beginning of personhood and of the human body is at the moment of conception.”

* Dr. Alfred Bongiovanni, University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine, concluded, “I am no more prepared to say that these early stages represent an incomplete human being than I would be to say that the child prior to the dramatic effects of puberty … is not a human being.”

* Dr. Richard V. Jaynes: “To say that the beginning of human life cannot be determined scientifically is utterly ridiculous.”

* Dr. Landrum Shettles, sometimes called the “Father of In Vitro Fertilization” notes, “Conception confers life and makes that life one of a kind.” And on the Supreme Court ruling _Roe v. Wade_, “To deny a truth [about when life begins] should not be made a basis for legalizing abortion.”

* Professor Eugene Diamond: “…either the justices were fed a backwoods biology or they were pretending ignorance about a scientific certainty.”
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For more detail:

https://prolifepages.wordpress.com/2012/09/19/when-does-human-life-begin/
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SideshowBob: In response to your post made here: - ummmm MU - 10/12 12:22:21
     RE: SideshowBob: In response to your post made here: - SideshowBob MU - 10/12 13:33:21
          natural rights certain can inform your moral code - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 13:35:10
               So you agree on the immorality of ripping unborn babies limb - JeffB MU - 10/12 14:46:34
                    frame this question in an unhysterical way and I will answer - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 15:57:29
     what are the specific natural rights? - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 12:29:23
          It begins with the right of self-ownership - pickle MU - 10/12 12:56:07
               Your rights come from God - Preacher UMKC - 10/12 13:19:40
                    natural rights are a human construct, they do not exist - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 14:09:19
                    Natural rights, not supernatural rights - pickle MU - 10/12 13:29:03
                         If God is a myth and natural rights really exist - Preacher UMKC - 10/12 13:36:58
                              Because although man's nature is cooperative - pickle MU - 10/12 13:40:19
                                   Well that is easy son. A world full of people without God - Preacher UMKC - 10/12 13:48:21
                                        That's not an answer - pickle MU - 10/12 13:53:08
                                             Here's my answer and I'm not going to fight about - MUGuy2004 STL - 10/12 14:08:48
                                                  free will doesn't exist if an omniscient god exists(nm) - cnk ATL - 10/12 14:15:11
                                                       that doesn't follow - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 14:23:54
                                                            Parents can't stop their kids from making bad choices. - MUGuy2004 STL - 10/12 14:25:54
                                                            that's exactly what that means(nm) - cnk ATL - 10/12 14:25:06
                                                                 no it isn't - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 14:28:36
                                                                      Let's pretend I'm an omniscient god - cnk ATL - 10/12 15:11:53
                                                                           yes you can - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 15:56:51
                                                                                how could you choose A? - cnk ATL - 10/12 16:01:25
                                                                                     I have the abililty to choose A - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 16:35:04
                                                                           You have a choice. Why would an omniscient God say - MUGuy2004 STL - 10/12 15:41:41
                                                                                How can you choose A if I already know you'll choose B?(nm) - cnk ATL - 10/12 15:44:11
                                                                                     I understand, I've asked the same questions. But, - MUGuy2004 STL - 10/12 15:46:16
                                                                                          you haven't answered my question(nm) - cnk ATL - 10/12 15:47:17
                                                                                               You are pre-supposing a lot in your question. You don't - MUGuy2004 STL - 10/12 15:48:34
                                                                                                    In the hypothetical I'm presenting, I know what choice you - cnk ATL - 10/12 15:51:32
                                                                                                         So you have given up on your kids? Nothing you can do - MUGuy2004 STL - 10/12 15:56:29
                                                       I know that is your hope(nm) - MUGuy2004 STL - 10/12 14:22:39
                                                  Edit: thought I was replying to Preacher - pickle MU - 10/12 14:12:43
                              Nm - TigerMatt MU - 10/12 13:39:12
                                   RE: If God is real, why is the world in chaos right - Preacher UMKC - 10/12 13:49:13
                                        Just as simple saying a world full of people not - TigerMatt MU - 10/12 13:51:39
                                   Beat me to it (nm) - pickle MU - 10/12 13:40:32
                    "nature" can (and does in my opinion) mean God - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 13:21:42
                         If you are a pantheist yes - Preacher UMKC - 10/12 13:25:58
                              Natural rights are inherent to all men - pickle MU - 10/12 13:35:31
                              Rights exist in spite of religion, not because - TigerMatt MU - 10/12 13:33:48
                              i'm not a pantheist - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 13:29:42
                                   What use are they if they cannot be exercised ? - Preacher UMKC - 10/12 13:34:51
                                        What prevents them from exercising natural rights?(nm) - TigerMatt MU - 10/12 13:35:39
                                        they have been brainwashed for decades - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 13:35:25
                                             LOL Why doesn"t the dictatorial regime recognize their - Preacher UMKC - 10/12 13:54:08
                                                  because recognizing those rights would prevent the regime - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 13:55:14
               When you actually take the time to learn it - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:01:17
                    If you have to 'take the time to learn it', that would - JeffB MU - 10/12 13:15:53
                         It is patently self-evident. Inherently, people act in - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:19:21
                              Not so sure about patently self-evident.... - JeffB MU - 10/12 13:36:09
                                   Lions and mosquitos have their own nature. - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:39:00
                                        Newsworthy, largely because they are against the law & - JeffB MU - 10/12 13:51:56
                                             Goddamn - pickle MU - 10/12 14:04:20
                                   Governments like a virus or plague does not - TigerMatt MU - 10/12 13:38:28
                                        What about the right to life of an unborn human being? - JeffB MU - 10/12 13:56:06
                                             A clump of human tissue is no different whether it is - TigerMatt MU - 10/12 14:03:34
                                                  He or she is a human being, not merely a clump of tissues, - JeffB MU - 10/12 14:38:29
                                                       Any cell is living. I can scrape off cheek cells and - TigerMatt MU - 10/12 15:11:35
                    Agreed. It's simple and non-controversial - pickle MU - 10/12 13:04:27
                         i don't think so - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 13:22:39
                              I could be wrong - pickle MU - 10/12 13:26:25
                                   many (most) do - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 13:31:23
                                        RE: many (most) do - pickle MU - 10/12 13:36:41
                                             I'm struggling to make the connection with that one to my - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 13:38:35
                                                  Subservience to "the common good" (nm) - pickle MU - 10/12 14:10:38
                                                       still not seeing it(nm) - MizzouAstro MU - 10/12 14:14:12
          Life, liberty, property. (nm) - ummmm MU - 10/12 12:29:43
               Are any other animals entitled to those rights? (nm) - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:07:44
                    No. Other animals have their own nature - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:08:28
                         What makes humans entitled to natural rights and other - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:13:03
                              The human's ability to reason and contemplate his own - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:17:47
                                   does a disabled human, with no ability to reason and - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:21:19
                                        Yes. Of course. (nm) - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:21:39
                                             But you said what makes humans entitled to natural - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:24:43
                                                  As in, the natural man. - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:25:33
                                                       If every single person was mentally disabled like in your - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:29:15
                                                            high five (nm) - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:45:25
                                                                 High five. (nm) - ummmm MU - 10/12 16:07:33
                         Aren't humans animals?(nm) - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 13:09:27
                              Yes. Humans are animals. - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:12:49
                                   Do we have the right to kill animals? - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 13:15:26
                                        The better way to put it, is to say that killing animals - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:21:09
                                             ok so animals don't have a right to life - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 13:25:33
                                                  Animals do not have a similar right to life as humans, since - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:27:25
                                                       where is the cutoff from human nature to animal nature? - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 13:32:38
                                                            Do we have any records on neanderthals ability to reason - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:36:21
                                                                 yes there is ample evidence, also are you saying the - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 13:40:50
                                                                      RE: yes there is ample evidence, also are you saying the - ummmm MU - 10/12 16:07:57
                                        RE: Do we have the right to kill animals? - pickle MU - 10/12 13:18:34
                                             So is your answer "no", humans don't have the right - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:20:27
                                                  Huh? The question was do animals have the right to life - pickle MU - 10/12 13:33:55
               ok I get that you have a right to live, but what do - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 12:31:51
                    RE: ok I get that you have a right to live, but what do - ummmm MU - 10/12 12:33:59
                         what about land? that hasn't been created by any man - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 12:42:57
                              Land is a form of property. - ummmm MU - 10/12 12:48:22
                                   so was the US Empire justified in its' acquisition of land? - Ragnar Danneskjold MU - 10/12 13:08:35
                                        There are a few issues at play in your post. - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:11:35
                                             how big is a homestead? (nm) - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:15:10
                                                  As big as the person can put to use and manage. - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:20:12
                                                       who determines what a person can use and manage - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:22:16
                                                            That person, and others who attempt to homestead land - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:24:54
                                                                 What happens if multiple parties claim first use - DC Jayhawk KU - 10/12 13:31:14
                                                                      They'll have to agree on an arbiter, or they will be stuck - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:35:26
                                                                           For some, the incentive is for constant dispute to exist. - DC Jayhawk KU - 10/12 13:39:42
                                                                                Well, to add to your hypothetical, there is a chance the - ummmm MU - 10/12 16:07:01
                                                                 Can one fence off a million unclaimed acres, to raise - TigerJackSwartz MU - 10/12 13:28:05
                                                                      Sure. Good luck to that person in - ummmm MU - 10/12 13:30:03




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