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Turkey out of NATO into alliance w Russia, China, Iran,
Posted on: January 8, 2023 at 13:41:05 CT
JeffB MU
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Syria, Pakistan?
erdogan-putin-s400s-turkey
Date: January 5, 2023
Author: Tom Luongo
5 Comments
While we are all, rightfully, worried about what’s going on in Ukraine, those sneaky Russians are shoring up their situation on the south shores of the Black Sea and Eastern Mediterranean.
As reported last week the meeting between Russia, Turkiye, and Syria took place between their Defense Ministers where they all described the talks as ‘constructive’ towards solving multiple outstanding issues like refugees and the backing of radicals.
This meeting was put in motion by Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan as the Moscow Times article notes:
In November, Erdogan said a meeting with Syrian leader Bashar al-Assad was a possibility, after cutting diplomatic ties with Damascus throughout the 11-year conflict.
In mid-December, he indicated that he could meet with Assad after the two countries’ defense and foreign ministers meet.
“We want to take a step as Syria, Turkey and Russia,” [emphasis mine] he said at the time.
The issues discussed are especially important for Erdogan as the protracted war is sapping his popularity at home in the face of an ongoing pull out of western capital from Turkey that has seen the lira go through what can only be described as a hyperinflation since 2018.
With elections on the horizon and Erdogan’s position tenuous for the first time in his political career, moves need to be made now to improve things. Allowing the millions of Syrian refugees the opportunity to go home would be a big win for Erdogan politically.
This is also a good use of Sergei Shoigu, the Russian Defense Minister, since he’s not in charge of the operation in Ukraine and hasn’t been since October, with good reason.
Shoigu, I’m sure, has been preparing for this meeting for months, laying the groundwork for talks between Turkiye and Syria that are long overdue.
As Alex Mercouris pointed out in a recent Duran video, Turkiye’s president Erdogan set three steps for a resolution of the conflict between it and Syria. This meeting of the Defense Ministers is the 2nd of them.
The Foreign Ministers are now clear to meet. Presumably, after that, Erdogan and Syrian President Bashar al-Assad will meet with the Russians as negotiator to hammer out an official end to Turkiye’s involvement in the Syrian War which began more than a decade ago.
Without Turkiye’s involvement in Syria, the Neocons’ goal of strangling Russia on gas imports to Europe never happens. This was the main impetus behind the Syrian War in the first place. To get him on board, Erdogan had to be bribed with a massive land grab, which he’s tried to accomplish.
But when he didn’t do enough to start a war with Russia in November 2015 after Turkiye supposedly shot down a Russian SU-24, he was rewarded with a coup attempt against him led by the CIA and US military out of the Incerlik airbase, by all accounts.
He was saved, apparently, by an early warning from Putin and ferried out to Iran to issue his counter-attack orders to the Turkish military on the night of the coup attempt.
This was the beginning of the end of Turkiye’s relationship with NATO and the US.
...
So, against that backdrop his making nice with Syria is a bombshell that the West shouldn’t be surprised about...
But the timing of this is the most inconvenient for the US/UK neocons who are clearly ramping up a 2023 regime change operation against Putin in Russia.
Con Coughlin at The Telegraph has come to this same conclusion in a screed that reads like a prelude to another attempt to get rid of this agitator in Ankara.
Turkey’s decision to press ahead with the Russian purchase [S-400’s] has not only put it on a collision course with Washington, which is threatening to scrap the F-35 deal at the end of the month; it also shows Ankara’s utter contempt for the Nato alliance, an attitude that key European member states such as Britain must demonstrate they are no longer able to tolerate.
His conclusion, Turkiye’s contempt for NATO, which I can’t really argue with, is grounds for its dismissal from the alliance.
But, as I said, this kind of reaction is exactly what Erdogan needs from the West, who have treated him and Turkiye as a fifth wheel for a long time. The neocons can frame his antics however they like but have they really thought through what happens after that?
Knowing the neocon mindset, I don’t think they have. They are so focused on Russia and convinced of the outcome of their war against it that they can just kick one of the largest armies in the world to the curb with immense geostrategic importance in the crotch and it won’t matter.
Without Turkiye’s backing in Idlib, the rebels there won’t survive in the long run. Erdogan will ratchet up his attacks on the SDF Kurds in the east backed by the US. This leaves Israel in a more tenuous position as well, surviving really only on Russia’s continued good graces.
Because the recent reports of US troops coming under intense missile attacks in Deir Ezzor where they are protecting the stealing of Syrian oil are a signpost that both Syria and Iran have had their shackles taken off by Putin in confronting the US in Syria.
In light of Angela Merkel’s admission of the Minsk Accords being a ruse to arm Ukraine, I don’t think you need further proof that Putin now has his legal ducks in a row to take the fight directly to the US, knowing that conflict is inevitable.
...
Now, with that narrative blown up — not for the normies, but for the Heads of State of the Global South — Putin is justified to no longer play footsie with the US through proxies.
There is no reason to not cross redlines that were always there as olive branches to form the basis of future diplomatic efforts. The current crop of morons and psychopaths leading the West with their prep school antics are irredeemable in the eyes of not just the Russians, but also now the Turks, Iranians, Chinese, Pakistanis, etc.
There are consequences to bragging on Twitter like Michael McFaul that as an ambassador he openly lied, or worse former Sec. of State Mike Pompeo making it effectively State Dept. policy to lie because that was his training at the CIA.
Need more proof? Putin just sold Iran dozens of SU-35s. This was another implicit redline to placate the US he just crossed, casually I might add. As long as Iran had a joke of an air force Putin could maintain at least the pretense that he was listening to the US.
But, now all of that is out the window.
Iran is selling Russia drones to wipe out the Ukrainian army and Russia is sending Iran SU-35s to end the threat of Israel doing any more long-range bombing runs in Iran.
The old stalemates are gone...
erdogan-putin-s400s-turkey
Date: January 5, 2023
Author: Tom Luongo
5 Comments
While we are all, rightfully, worried about what’s going on in Ukraine, those sneaky Russians are shoring up their situation on the south shores of the Black Sea and Eastern Mediterranean.
As reported last week the meeting between Russia, Turkiye, and Syria took place between their Defense Ministers where they all described the talks as ‘constructive’ towards solving multiple outstanding issues like refugees and the backing of radicals.
This meeting was put in motion by Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan as the Moscow Times article notes:
In November, Erdogan said a meeting with Syrian leader Bashar al-Assad was a possibility, after cutting diplomatic ties with Damascus throughout the 11-year conflict.
In mid-December, he indicated that he could meet with Assad after the two countries’ defense and foreign ministers meet.
“We want to take a step as Syria, Turkey and Russia,” [emphasis mine] he said at the time.
The issues discussed are especially important for Erdogan as the protracted war is sapping his popularity at home in the face of an ongoing pull out of western capital from Turkey that has seen the lira go through what can only be described as a hyperinflation since 2018.
With elections on the horizon and Erdogan’s position tenuous for the first time in his political career, moves need to be made now to improve things. Allowing the millions of Syrian refugees the opportunity to go home would be a big win for Erdogan politically.
This is also a good use of Sergei Shoigu, the Russian Defense Minister, since he’s not in charge of the operation in Ukraine and hasn’t been since October, with good reason.
Shoigu, I’m sure, has been preparing for this meeting for months, laying the groundwork for talks between Turkiye and Syria that are long overdue.
As Alex Mercouris pointed out in a recent Duran video, Turkiye’s president Erdogan set three steps for a resolution of the conflict between it and Syria. This meeting of the Defense Ministers is the 2nd of them.
The Foreign Ministers are now clear to meet. Presumably, after that, Erdogan and Syrian President Bashar al-Assad will meet with the Russians as negotiator to hammer out an official end to Turkiye’s involvement in the Syrian War which began more than a decade ago.
Without Turkiye’s involvement in Syria, the Neocons’ goal of strangling Russia on gas imports to Europe never happens. This was the main impetus behind the Syrian War in the first place. To get him on board, Erdogan had to be bribed with a massive land grab, which he’s tried to accomplish.
But when he didn’t do enough to start a war with Russia in November 2015 after Turkiye supposedly shot down a Russian SU-24, he was rewarded with a coup attempt against him led by the CIA and US military out of the Incerlik airbase, by all accounts.
He was saved, apparently, by an early warning from Putin and ferried out to Iran to issue his counter-attack orders to the Turkish military on the night of the coup attempt.
This was the beginning of the end of Turkiye’s relationship with NATO and the US.
...
So, against that backdrop his making nice with Syria is a bombshell that the West shouldn’t be surprised about...
But the timing of this is the most inconvenient for the US/UK neocons who are clearly ramping up a 2023 regime change operation against Putin in Russia.
Con Coughlin at The Telegraph has come to this same conclusion in a screed that reads like a prelude to another attempt to get rid of this agitator in Ankara.
Turkey’s decision to press ahead with the Russian purchase [S-400’s] has not only put it on a collision course with Washington, which is threatening to scrap the F-35 deal at the end of the month; it also shows Ankara’s utter contempt for the Nato alliance, an attitude that key European member states such as Britain must demonstrate they are no longer able to tolerate.
His conclusion, Turkiye’s contempt for NATO, which I can’t really argue with, is grounds for its dismissal from the alliance.
But, as I said, this kind of reaction is exactly what Erdogan needs from the West, who have treated him and Turkiye as a fifth wheel for a long time. The neocons can frame his antics however they like but have they really thought through what happens after that?
Knowing the neocon mindset, I don’t think they have. They are so focused on Russia and convinced of the outcome of their war against it that they can just kick one of the largest armies in the world to the curb with immense geostrategic importance in the crotch and it won’t matter.
Without Turkiye’s backing in Idlib, the rebels there won’t survive in the long run. Erdogan will ratchet up his attacks on the SDF Kurds in the east backed by the US. This leaves Israel in a more tenuous position as well, surviving really only on Russia’s continued good graces.
Because the recent reports of US troops coming under intense missile attacks in Deir Ezzor where they are protecting the stealing of Syrian oil are a signpost that both Syria and Iran have had their shackles taken off by Putin in confronting the US in Syria.
In light of Angela Merkel’s admission of the Minsk Accords being a ruse to arm Ukraine, I don’t think you need further proof that Putin now has his legal ducks in a row to take the fight directly to the US, knowing that conflict is inevitable.
...
Now, with that narrative blown up — not for the normies, but for the Heads of State of the Global South — Putin is justified to no longer play footsie with the US through proxies.
There is no reason to not cross redlines that were always there as olive branches to form the basis of future diplomatic efforts. The current crop of morons and psychopaths leading the West with their prep school antics are irredeemable in the eyes of not just the Russians, but also now the Turks, Iranians, Chinese, Pakistanis, etc.
There are consequences to bragging on Twitter like Michael McFaul that as an ambassador he openly lied, or worse former Sec. of State Mike Pompeo making it effectively State Dept. policy to lie because that was his training at the CIA.
Need more proof? Putin just sold Iran dozens of SU-35s. This was another implicit redline to placate the US he just crossed, casually I might add. As long as Iran had a joke of an air force Putin could maintain at least the pretense that he was listening to the US.
But, now all of that is out the window.
Iran is selling Russia drones to wipe out the Ukrainian army and Russia is sending Iran SU-35s to end the threat of Israel doing any more long-range bombing runs in Iran.
The old stalemates are gone...
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Turkey out of NATO into alliance w Russia, China, Iran, - JeffB MU - 1/8 13:41:05